Failure rate of consumer shells/cakes?

[Walt]

I’ve been shooting for a little over a decade now. Historically my shows are maybe 20-30 cakes and 3-4 MCR’s. This year things have escalated quite a bit, 3 shows, something like 400 cakes, a total of nearly 800 premium cans, mostly being shot out of MCR’s.

I shoot on a beach with a couple of natural berms between houses and 80-100ft of distance. I’ve always dug pits and surrounded them with sand berms for the mortars.

This year I’m starting to really wonder about the saftey involved. It only takes 1 bad shell. And I’ve never done berms around the cake boards because of the size of berm that would entail. But it seems like a bad shell in a cake could be equally dangerous.

I buy all my product from a reputable vendor out of Wisconsin, mostly Pyro King product, some raccoon, winda, brothers, and Fox.

Curious to hear from some of the more seasoned folks and people who shoot more product annually, what your experience has been with failure rates of consumer products? I don’t mean loading it upside down, but actual failure and catos or cakes being blow apart etc.

And as a secondary question, has anyone deployed physical barriers to mitigate clearance issues? 3/4 plywood for example as “wall/pen” around mortar locations etc?

[Rick_In_Tampa]

80' between houses is asking for trouble IMHO. Using milk crate racks in sand is also inadvisable. If 1 tube bounces when lit, it can fly right out of the crate, with 24 more tubes to (potentially) follow. As for "regular" effects (500G cakes, etc.) I have a few cato or just not fire every year. I've received some effects that were literally falling apart when they arrived, and I had to put them back together again.

I don't use any additional barriers, just distance.

[Walt]

80' between houses is asking for trouble IMHO. Using milk crate racks in sand is also inadvisable. If 1 tube bounces when lit, it can fly right out of the crate, with 24 more tubes to (potentially) follow. As for "regular" effects (500G cakes, etc.) I have a few cato or just not fire every year. I've received some effects that were literally falling apart when they arrived, and I had to put them back together again.

I don't use any additional barriers, just distance.

Want to clarify what I meant regarding the shoot site as I think it came out a little convoluted.

It is an ocean beach, the beach is "straight" for all intents and purposes. If you are at the shoot site and look left or right, you see miles of distance. All good there. Straight ahead, ocean, all good there.

The berms I mentioned are the land rising up behind you. Here is a crude drawing.

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The distances to houses left and right of the house we are shooting from are in excess of 150ft. My thinking is perhaps it makes sense to put the mortars as close to the berm as possible, to use a natural barrier.

As for milk crates, they all have 3/4" wood bases, and I've shoot them in sand many times with no bounces. I dig them down about half way and then dig a sand berm around them as well.


As for the yearly Cato's, that's troubling. I haven't had that same experience (yet). I've fixed up a couple slices of cakes here and there that seemed loose but nothing abhorrent. Do you use the same vendor every year?

[BMoore]

The standard is 70' distance per inch of shell so that's 122.5 for vertical mortars. If this were a professional show you may be granted a 1/3 offset for angled mortars so realistically, that's probably your only option for the distances you are are working with. If it were me I'd get as close to the water as possible and angle my mortars and cakes about 8 degrees to fire over the water. That's the only option I see provided your audience is also at least that far back. I never worry about additional barriers personally. Distance is your friend. I'd also ditch the milk crates. You are on the beach so you have the opportunity to bury your mortars in sand which is about as safe as you can get. As far as failure rates, I'd say today's products are very reliable. I have hundreds of canister shells in my show every year and I can't remember the last time one failed on me. Having said that, remember these are hand made items and defects are always possible so always plan for the worst.

[Walt]

The standard is 70' distance per inch of shell so that's 122.5 for vertical mortars. If this were a professional show you may be granted a 1/3 offset for angled mortars so realistically, that's probably your only option for the distances you are are working with. If it were me I'd get as close to the water as possible and angle my mortars and cakes about 8 degrees to fire over the water. That's the only option I see provided your audience is also at least that far back. I never worry about additional barriers personally. Distance is your friend. I'd also ditch the milk crates. You are on the beach so you have the opportunity to bury your mortars in sand which is about as safe as you can get. As far as failure rates, I'd say today's products are very reliable. I have hundreds of canister shells in my show every year and I can't remember the last time one failed on me. Having said that, remember these are hand made items and defects are always possible so always plan for the worst.

Should have mentioned we typically strive for a 10-15deg angle on all product to get it well out over the ocean, especially with what is usually an onshore wind bring all the cardboard debris back. Good to know that the 1/3’ offset is an actual thing in the pro world. I have a lot to learn.

I’ve never thought much about the milk crates the way I’ve always built them up in the sand, but this year things have escalated and crossing my fingers this show goes well, I plan to do things different next year. I have about a 3 hour window to setup my shoots on the night of, so digging 150+ tubes in and fusing on the spot is not an option. This years show (for the 3rd) is already pre fused with another 6 crates to be reloaded for the shoot on the 4th.

Next year I think I’ll keep all the MCR’s but utilize less spicy ball shells for the finales in them, and build more proper spacer racks for any/all can shells. I’ve got 2x 30 shot fan racks racks and a 3 shot vertical rack already.

I think for this year I’ll do as you’re suggesting and just use every inch of distance I can get, + the angle, + I’ll really beef up the sand berm around the mortars in both height and size.

[PyroJoeNEPA]

I have to say I shudder when ever I hear reference to the "Three Letter Demons"--IRS, FBI, INS, DHS, CIA, anddddddddddddddddd "MCR".
I know some of you will get your knickers in a twist when I say that, but, hey, guys, if it is worth doing, then do it properly
Just because you have used MCR's for years without an issue [yet] doesn't guarantee it will always be so!
I can't cut straight with a table saw, but I can build a safe, sturdy proper rack for my tubes.

[Engineer Cat]

It's not IF it happens, but WHEN it happens. Ditch the MCR's. I'm actually surprised you been shooting for as long as you have but still have MCR's in use. That should be your priority as that is the most dangerous part of your show from what I'm reading. Are the mortars HDPE?

[Walt]

MCR’s are all DR11 HDPE from pyroboom.

The fan racks are fiberglass tubes, with spacers.

[Engineer Cat]

MCR’s are all DR11 HDPE from pyroboom.

The fan racks are fiberglass tubes, with spacers.

Nice, Make more of those racks for the DR11!

[topshelfpyro]

I bought pyro king brand cakes 2 years in a row (5 years ago) and both years I had cakes explode.....never bought another. Sometimes have low firing cake tubes, low bursts from shells, rarely have a cake blow a tube. I put barriers in front of the cake boards/mortar racks usually.

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