Comet effect

[Engineer Cat]

Hey all, so I have seen this design / effect used with comets in some of your shows. Of course now that I want to try this in my next show, I can't find the videos that have the effect in it. I used the firework sim software to try to get it aligned right so I have an idea of what needs to be done but I figured it would also be best to ask those of you who have done it before.

Here's a Childs drawing of what the effect looks like. If it has a name I would love to know what it is. I like the rising arch effect that is created.

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My first question is... Is there a known angle and spacing that is used for each comet to get this effect?

Second, from testing it in the sim software it appears all 4 comets would need to be fired simultaneously to get that effect. If they are 4 feet from each other in line, is there any worry about them hitting each other in the air? I would think no being they are spaced apart and not pointing at each other like when trying to have comets cross each other in the air BUT being they would cross paths I'm just not sure.

[displayfireworks1]

Looks like parabolic curve. I believe you need special racking to create it with one shot AP product. I believe you do not line it up in the same row, rather each shot is in the next row etc. Perhaps someone else can explain.

[Scotty Rockets]

Visual software is perfect for creating complicated patterns. Chances of colliding are rare and if so it’s nothing to be concerned about. For good parabolic curves your positions should be no more than 50’ from each other.

[esgrillo]

I did in my 2021 show. You will need spacing WAY wider than 4ft. I had 7 locations each about 40ft apart so about 240ft wide total. For the angles I just used my craig style racks at each location with the flattest I could get on the end which was about 15 degress to 90degree on the other. It ended up being about 15 degree increments. They all fire at the same time. I did a few of them starting at the 2:00 mark


https://youtu.be/F5gTM8YJTB4?t=121

[Engineer Cat]

Ah parabolic curves! Thanks Dave.

Good to know that I don't have to worry to much about collisions.

Ed I knew I saw it in a video or two here but couldn't find it. I only have 20 feet wide to work with. I might be able to spread it out to 30 feet if I'm a bit creative but that might not be enough to make the effect work. That's the difficult part when trying to get the idea down using a sim since my shoot location is a dock that's not very big. I usually have left and right effects angled so I fill the sky more and it works great but for this effect I'm not sure if I can spread the comets out enough to get the desired effect.

[Engineer Cat]

I have my first club meeting / shoot next month. (I'm supposed to be voted in that day). If so I might be able to try this out in a small footprint to see if the effect will still work depending on how they setup the C line. I'll probably just find a cake with comets and remove the comets for the test if the club bylaws permit it.

[WithReport]

Yeah, these are typically referred to as parabolic curves. We added a whole bunch in the 2022 Madness Collides show - "collides" was a focus on these curves.

@Engineering Cat, you need to proof that "engineering" title - breakout out the Y=ax^2+bx+c ;)

A number of years ago I created a spread sheet where I could adjust firing positions and angles to create the desired parabola. Here the gray dash line is the plot of y=.007x^2. I can then adjust my positions and angles to match. You can see the match to the actual parabola is better on the right than the left. This was just me playing around comparing left to right.

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There is also some visual software out there that provides free trials and you can play around and try it out.

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We did some tests too, here is our tests we used prior to our 2022 4th of July show. We tested the silver comets and during the show we had silver, green, red, and gold. The green went much farther - I was a bit surprised and startled during the show.

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As you see I ended up with seven positions and was able to run all seven positions off one module with parallel rails. In the 4th of July show, we had 24 inward/outward or other similar patterns fired from these 7 positions.

Spacing will depend on the size of your comet. Our spacing was at 20ft - I don't have a big wide space. So they were at 20ft and in front of most all other positions to provide a larger appearance. The comets used were all teardowns from the 200g Razzle cakes.

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[WithReport]

I should add that on the 4th, they got all the boards leveled out on the field, but they were all pointing at slightly different angles in the field. You can see the one in the foreground is basically aimed towards the tower rather than perpendicular across the field. This did affect the look a bit. Something I'll have to pay more attention too in the future.


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And the Madness Collide show basically starts out with a bunch of green parabolas (Madness Collides 2022: https://youtu.be/3gyX-npu1D0) These greens shot a bit farther (into and through the trees) than I was expecting or had tested with the silvers.

[PyroJoeNEPA]

I have my first club meeting / shoot next month. (I'm supposed to be voted in that day). If so I might be able to try this out in a small footprint to see if the effect will still work depending on how they setup the C line. I'll probably just find a cake with comets and remove the comets for the test if the club bylaws permit it.

Red Razzle or Silver Razzle woudl be a good cake to try this with. Since the bore of the tubes is noticeably smalle than the typical single shots you can do a "smaller" version to get the feel of it.

[Engineer Cat]

Awesome scientific data Withreport! Really in depth info on the parabola.

For the record the "engineer" part refers to producing music. ;)

I've seen post of other people mentioning use of the Razzle for comets Joe. Hopefully I can find some Friday night so I can break them down for Sat.

[WithReport]

Red Razzle or Silver Razzle woudl be a good cake to try this with. Since the bore of the tubes is noticeably smalle than the typical single shots you can do a "smaller" version to get the feel of it.

Yeah, we had to do the razzles just because we don't have the room to do parabolas and patterns with larger product.



Awesome scientific data Withreport! Really in depth info on the parabola.

For the record the "engineer" part refers to producing music. ;)

Ah, I was just having fun. Most of the shapes aren't simple parabolas, but they are close enough. Now we know who to ask some more audio questions - I picked up my own 10 channel mixer board for the first time this year. As for audio and parbolas, you should check out parabolic mics (like the sound guy running around with the big radar dish on the football sidelines) and parabolic speakers - the speakers are popular in museums as it focus the sound to a limited area.


Another way to look at these is nail-and-string art. You just have to picture that the comet doesn't just terminate at a nail and there is going to be some projectile-motion drop due to gravity.

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[Engineer Cat]

Ah, I was just having fun. Most of the shapes aren't simple parabolas, but they are close enough. Now we know who to ask some more audio questions - I picked up my own 10 channel mixer board for the first time this year. As for audio and parbolas, you should check out parabolic mics (like the sound guy running around with the big radar dish on the football sidelines) and parabolic speakers - the speakers are popular in museums as it focus the sound to a limited area.


Another way to look at these is nail-and-string art. You just have to picture that the comet doesn't just terminate at a nail and there is going to be some projectile-motion drop due to gravity.

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Ahh the string art! I would of never of thought of that until the algorithm picked up on my parabolic curve searches and start sending me string art pictures. LMAO

Yea those mics and speakers are pretty cool. Recently I was looking at speakers for a sports bar I was wiring up with really stupid tall ceilings. They have some really cool looking parabolic speakers now that you really wouldn't even know are parabolic from the design. Quite pricey though.

I install structured cable and do IT work as a paying job. Owning a recording studio really didn't bring in enough money to satisfy me so I had to bail on that. It was fun while it lasted. I still have some equipment from the studio and installed it in my basement so when my wife or I feel like trying to write a song or come up with a beat, we have the instruments and the equipment to do it. You'll love having a 10 channel board. Depending on what you are doing with it, read up on Bussing. It could be useful to you.

[CafreakinBOOM]

Hello my people

I would contact Dan Tanner at Tanneriteexplosives.com
He has the AP products that could work for you and
He is a great person to talk to and ask for advice on his product