DIY Wireless Firing System Update [EDIT]

[FBpyro]

Hello all,

A while back I shared my homemade DIY fireworks firing system called the "FlashFire", well since then there have been some major improvements to it and I'd like to take a moment to share again. Please let me know what you all think and any suggestions. Here are some of the specifications:

-Can fire 64 independent igniters
-Has a "fire all" mode where all channels are fired in rapid succession
-Wireless with a range of up to ~500ft depending on obstructions
-3D printed enclosure for both remote and field module
-Uses 18V (2X9V in series) to fire the squibs
-Used custom made slats to connect to the squibs


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SIW2eVkuv0s&t=4s

http://www.pyrotalk.com/bulletin/attachment.php?attachmentid=5776&stc=1
http://www.pyrotalk.com/bulletin/attachment.php?attachmentid=5777&stc=1
http://www.pyrotalk.com/bulletin/attachment.php?attachmentid=5778&stc=1
http://www.pyrotalk.com/bulletin/attachment.php?attachmentid=5779&stc=1

[Arles]

Very cool!

[Engineer Cat]

I'm surprised the parts cost you $400. I would of thought they would of been cheaper considering all the cheap Chinese systems out there.

Kudos to you for building your own from scratch. Very impressive. You can't put a price on the satisfaction of working out all the details and seeing the final product function as you intended.

[FBpyro]

Thank you Engineer Cat, yeah you would think a home-built system would be significantly cheaper but the reality is once you factor in time and some of the components are pricey, it only becomes marginally cheaper than buying one off the shelf. The one component that was very expensive was the 16 solid state relays used in the field module to create a cross matrix (8 X 8 = 64), the specific relays I used were around $4 each! I have attempted to make a new design that just uses MOSFETs which are way cheaper, however, turning a FET on and off properly isn't that trivial, especially when you're trying to supply current on the high side of the igniter (source instead of sink). Sorry if I got too technical but anyways I appreciate your comments.

[Engineer Cat]

I totally get what your saying, I just couldn't build it myself. LOL

[Scotty Rockets]

I'm surprised the parts cost you $400. I would of thought they would of been cheaper considering all the cheap Chinese systems out there.

Kudos to you for building your own from scratch. Very impressive. You can't put a price on the satisfaction of working out all the details and seeing the final product function as you intended.

Honestly not surprising at all, His system is far more advanced and superior to those cheap chinese units. This also gives some prospective into why the advanced systems like firetek, mongoose and cobra are not cheap.

[jamisonlm3]

Scotty Rockets, one benefit the cheap systems have is they can be spread out a ways to create more than a single position.

[WithReport]

Scotty Rockets, one benefit the cheap systems have is they can be spread out a ways to create more than a single position.

No doubt there is truth there, but being able to spread cues out without buying a lot of hardware was one my initial criteria when getting into more advanced systems without spending too much.

I started with a couple 12 cue RFRemotech units, that could be learned to a common remote. I even added some single cue alpha modules to the system and I have no regrets with those units - I still have them. When I eventually wanted to increase my cue count I considered upgrading to a different system and did a lot of comparisons across everything I could find on the market at the time. Eventually I went with a single fireTEK 48 cue module. with that 48 cue module I was able to split my slats in parallel with 100ft of cat5 cable in opposite directions for a 200ft spread and have a rail in the middle, too.

In comparison, to put 48 parallel cues on the left, center, and right that would have been 12 of the Remotech units (running around $100 each and 4 remotes). Or to compare to the popular 4-cue modules out there running on AA batteries it would be 36 of the 4-cue units out there (I could purchase a 48 cue system for around $150 and four more $80 packs of 6 receivers would be over $600 not including shipping and the +144 batteries needed).

I'm not dogging any of those systems, but I did some OCD comparisons of features and costs before increasing my cue count to figure out what was going to work best for me and it wasn't more of the cheap modules.



On the topic of this DIY unit. Excellent job FBPyro and it is turning out very impressive. As other's have mentioned, it's tough to put a price on creating it yourself.

I am curious on the decision for shielded cables and using the shield as a common ground. You mention that the shield may be limiting your cable length and I assume the shield has more resistance than the eight conductors.

[Scotty Rockets]

I gave up on the cheap China units immediately after year 1 after they failed to fire at show time. Forever jaded on those pieces of junk. And nowadays I hear stories of these things malfunctioning and firing intentionally.

[Arclight]

FYI, you might want to look at the automotive high-side driver chips from TI. I built a lighting controller with a 4 channel IC, and there are larger ones too. You can cut cost and component count by doing it this way.

[DavidthePyro]

Can you elaborate on the malfunctioning stories at all?

I can't yet afford an advanced system. I use several 4 cue mods and this year am running a script. I launch from 3 positions and last year had no issues at all. Now I'm worried. I'm still about a year our from purchasing an advanced firing system. http://www.pyrotalk.com/bulletin/attachment.php?attachmentid=5785&stc=1

[Scotty Rockets]

Can you elaborate on the malfunctioning stories at all?

I can't yet afford an advanced system. I use several 4 cue mods and this year am running a script. I launch from 3 positions and last year had no issues at all. Now I'm worried. I'm still about a year our from purchasing an advanced firing system. 5785

It’s happening on new units, and I know of 3 instances that was reported on another pyro group. If you have been using them with no issue then you should be okay. For those of you that recently bought these and haven’t tested them, make sure you do. You need to do a live test with an ematch or firewire. Seems the cheap circuitry are defective in some of the modules.

[DavidthePyro]

Thanks for the heads up.

I did just buy 2 six packs of modules about 2 months ago.

I noticed one randomly lit one of my test lights and thought it was related to the new scripting device I'm a guinea pig for basically.

I will throw some talons and mjgs in the new mods to make sure I'm safe.

Thanks!

[FBpyro]

WithReport, thank you! I appreciate the kind words. As indeed mentioned in the video the main disadvantage is how far I can place the slats from the field module. If I use >10ft long ethernet cables I start having issues with the igniters not firing reliably, however, I'm not sure if this is more of a resistance issue with the cables or the fact that they are acting as a giant capacitance to the system. If you think about it, ethernet cables have twisted pairs of wire inside them, and any two metal objects separated by some sort of insulator such as just air will form a basic capacitor. If I use short ethernet cables between the slats and the field module but just extend my squib wires, I have no issues.

[FBpyro]

Scotty Rockets, one benefit the cheap systems have is they can be spread out a ways to create more than a single position.

I eventually plan on redesigning the receiving side of my system to only support 8 cues, then I could build the receivers cheap enough that I could make multiples and thus spread them apart in the field. Each receiver will have a single button on it with a 7 segment display that will tell you the radio channel it's currently on, and the user can press the button to change the channel, then the remote will be capable of selecting it's matching radio channel to communicate with only the field module that's on it's matching RF channel. The advantage of doing it this way is that it would be possible to set multiple field modules all to the same channel and they will respond in unison with remote commands.

[Arles]

Thanks for the heads up.

I did just buy 2 six packs of modules about 2 months ago.

I noticed one randomly lit one of my test lights and thought it was related to the new scripting device I'm a guinea pig for basically.

I will throw some talons and mjgs in the new mods to make sure I'm safe.

Thanks!

I'm not sure I would assume it not going off during testing means you're safe.

[bani]

Thank you Engineer Cat, yeah you would think a home-built system would be significantly cheaper but the reality is once you factor in time and some of the components are pricey, it only becomes marginally cheaper than buying one off the shelf. The one component that was very expensive was the 16 solid state relays used in the field module to create a cross matrix (8 X 8 = 64), the specific relays I used were around $4 each! I have attempted to make a new design that just uses MOSFETs which are way cheaper, however, turning a FET on and off properly isn't that trivial, especially when you're trying to supply current on the high side of the igniter (source instead of sink). Sorry if I got too technical but anyways I appreciate your comments.

I did a design which uses a single cpc1706y SSR on highside and several uln2066b darlington arrays on lowside. Super simple and easy.

[SvnTwoo]

I gave up on the cheap China units immediately after year 1 after they failed to fire at show time. Forever jaded on those pieces of junk. And nowadays I hear stories of these things malfunctioning and firing intentionally.

I hear that on the China systems... I had a buddy this year have 140 mortars go up right after they armed their show, turns out a guy used his key fob to open his trunk and it fired an entire module. They reset the mortars and started the show 30 minutes later, after the show the guy who popped his trunk came over and explained that the second he hit his button on the fob it went up. So they tested it and found that remote frequency in fact fired the queues.

I told him it was time to upgrade to an encrypted firing system.

[bani]

I hear that on the China systems... I had a buddy this year have 140 mortars go up right after they armed their show, turns out a guy used his key fob to open his trunk and it fired an entire module. They reset the mortars and started the show 30 minutes later, after the show the guy who popped his trunk came over and explained that the second he hit his button on the fob it went up. So they tested it and found that remote frequency in fact fired the queues.

I told him it was time to upgrade to an encrypted firing system.

yeah, i bought one of the cheap chinese systems many years ago. they use simple On-Off keying and will get triggered by just about anything. i looked up the part# of the remote and it was a garage door opener remote.