insurance/local laws

[Marky]

Hello im a new member and soon to be a type 54 permit holder.I have my interview friday thanks to Daves informative videos.So im trying to be legal on the local side of things since i will beable to purchase 1.3g in the future.I called the supervisor in redstone township and they told me in order to get a local permit signed i need liability insurance even for private display.I thought i had the hard part out of the way by getting my atf license,there's no way i can afford firework insurance for the prices i seen.I wonder if my homeowners insurance would be acceptable insurance to get the permit signed?i would be shooting in my yard and my neighbors are a few hundred yards away.Any advice would be appreciated.

[PyroManiacs]

Welcome to PyroTalk!

Im sure someone will answer your question soon.

[mguerra]

I was unable to get my homeowners insurance to cover 1.3G displays. The cheapest insurance I can find is $5,000.00 per year or $1,500.00 per shoot. I now shoot my shows under the auspices of the display company I buy product from, to be able to get the insurance. I am an employee possesor and the licensed pyrotechnician for the show, I buy the product from the company and pay a fee for the insurance. This was not my original plan for my pyro hobby. But I am not willing to shoot 1.3G without insurance, so I do it this way. According to my reading of Texas law, it may NOT be necessary to have insurance for a not in commerce show. But I am not willing to expose myself to this liability, regardless of the law. Insurance is a HUGE problem for the hobbyist.

[Northern Sky]

Check with your 1.3 supplier for ship-show insurance. It usually runs about 10% of the product purchased needing to be usually 80% of the product shot to be purchased from them.

In many townships in PA they will accept a bond of $500-$1,000. Write the township a check to be returned is no claims are made against it. Many will take that in place of $1 million insurance.

[Marky]

I was unable to get my homeowners insurance to cover 1.3G displays. The cheapest insurance I can find is $5,000.00 per year or $1,500.00 per shoot. I now shoot my shows under the auspices of the display company I buy product from, to be able to get the insurance. I am an employee possesor and the licensed pyrotechnician for the show, I buy the product from the company and pay a fee for the insurance. This was not my original plan for my pyro hobby. But I am not willing to shoot 1.3G without insurance, so I do it this way. According to my reading of Texas law, it may NOT be necessary to have insurance for a not in commerce show. But I am not willing to expose myself to this liability, regardless of the law. Insurance is a HUGE problem for the hobbyist.
I hear you on the liability issues,i may talk to my soon to be supplier of 1.3g about insurance once i get my permit.Thanks for the info.

[Marky]

Check with your 1.3 supplier for ship-show insurance. It usually runs about 10% of the product purchased needing to be usually 80% of the product shot to be purchased from them.

In many townships in PA they will accept a bond of $500-$1,000. Write the township a check to be returned is no claims are made against it. Many will take that in place of $1 million insurance.
Thats great advice thanks.I will ask my supplier about that ship show insurance.When i called township they seemed not to know much at all about the local firework laws,he said after a few minutes that none of us supervisors will sign anything for fireworks unless you got some type of liability insurance.I wonder if they know about the law that says they can accept the bond?

[Northern Sky]

it all comes down to the township. i did a show this summer with a $25 permit fee ATF license and $500 bond. No Fire or police needed. it was the second request the supervisor processed in the last 4 years. Many people just wing it around there. the Fire Chief wouldn't admit it but i got the impression that he shoots bigger displays than I did with no permit. I do know of several other displays in that township. I guess they are not permitted displays. To me it isn't worth the risk not to permit incased anything happens.

[MIpyro]

I was told my the ATF officer that interviewed me that if you cannot get a fire truck or safety officer at your shoot site, have the home/land owner sign a waiver to cover your butt and that they are responsible for any damages. Just what the interviewer told me..lol!

[MIpyro]

But I don't shoot 1.3 unless I have a fire or police officer at the site.

[displayfireworks1]

At Marky
Do me a favor and do not call the township any more. I am trying to find what local governing body your city is and if they have a website. When you call these people you usually do not get the answer you want to hear. Find the website for your local. Then see if they have any type of fireworks ordnance on the books, my money is they do not. In Pennsylvania no local ordinance is the same as no permit required, by then you will have your Federal License. But I do not expect you to get that adventuresome. Wait until you get your ATF license, then you write a formal request with a date, time and location. You state in the letter your are licensed and write the numbers from the license on the letter. This will confuse them and they will most likely have their solicitor research it. There he will find the Pennsylvania state law written in like 1933 that requires you to submit a $300.00 deposit in the event a clean up is needed. This assumes you are shooting on private property with proper clearance and not for profit. If they do not have to clean up after you they can not cash the check.
I went through this in Charters Township Pennsylvania and received a permit years back. I invite the fire department, they loved it. My experience has been the first permit is always the hardest, subsequent ones get easier. I tell people sometimes if you wait for everyone to tell you it is ok to shoot fireworks, you may never shoot them, if you really think about it in the day and age we live in, who would sign off on anything potentially dangerous.

[PyroManiacs]

Wealth of info there Dave!

[MIpyro]

great info Dave!

[Marky]

Dave thank you for the great info.I was calling the township to see what was required once i recieved my license but as you stated we live in a time when everybody is out to sue,i can see why townships shy away from it. i got on there website but there's no info on there.The site doesnt look like its been updated in awhile.Dave i live in redstone township fayette county,pa about 25 minutes from keystone fireworks in dunbar,pa.

[Marky]

Thanks everyone for your advice.im very happy i joined this forum,there is alot of good info here.

[PyroManiacs]

Speaking of towns without a fireworks ordinance.....Is there a database of all the Pa counties/townships and their fireworks ordinances?

[jknepp1954]

Speaking of towns without a fireworks ordinance.....Is there a database of all the Pa counties/townships and their fireworks ordinances?

unfortunately NO!

[PyroManiacs]

How do we compile one?

I was looking at all the counties in alphabetical order and started searching for each ones ordinance/regulations links...

It actually took me over an hour to come up wit only the first 2 counties, lol.

Maybe we can have some members of whatever county they are from try to do a little search on it.

Maybe I will just start a new thread on it and start off with Philadelphia's Code.

[Northern Sky]

unfortunetly it doesn't work by county, it is by local city or township.

[displayfireworks1]

At Marky
My video "Fireworks on the Farm" is from the Dunbar area. Scott is a member on the forums, he gets fireworks permits, lets see if he comments, he may know something about your area.

[Marky]

At Marky
My video "Fireworks on the Farm" is from the Dunbar area. Scott is a member on the forums, he gets fireworks permits, lets see if he comments, he may know something about your area.
Thanks Dave!